Interview with Mark Switow, September 20, 2016

ELY: Hey. I'm Carol Ely, I'm here with Mark Switow for the Jewish Kentucky Oral History Project, sponsored by the Jewish Heritage Fund for Excellence. It's September 20th, 2016. Thank you for agreeing to do this interview, Mark. Uh--

SWITOW: It's an honor, my pleasure.

ELY: I appreciate your coming down. So we'll start with just some basic personal questions that I'm sure you will know the answers to, like when and where were you born?

SWITOW: Jewish Hospital in Louisville, Kentucky, 1958.

ELY: Jewish Hospital. Good start for a Jewish boy in Kentucky.

SWITOW: (laughs) It was. There weren't--there weren't a whole lot of choices then where you were going to be born.

ELY: And, uh, what were your parents' names and occupations at that point?

SWITOW: S--Sure. So Maxine Rudman Switow, uh, originally from, uh, Richmond, Virginia, married, uh, Irvin Bloom, better known as Sonny Switow. And, uh, dad was born and raised here in Louisville. He went to Male High School.

ELY: And, uh, did you have brothers and sisters growing up?

SWITOW: I do. I did, and--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --uh, they're both still with us. Um, my sister Arlene is two years 00:01:00older, and she lives out west in Colorado. And my brother Michael is nine years my junior, and he lives in Singapore.

ELY: Oh.

SWITOW: Neither one of them have ever come back to Kentucky since leaving, uh, for college.

ELY: So just to take it back a bit, and then we'll come to your own story, tell me about the first members of your family that you know about who came to Kentucky or came to Louisville.

SWITOW: OK. So there was Michael and Annie Switow. And Michael Switow actually wrote a thirty-seven-page autobiography about how he ended up in Louisville. Uh, so here, you have a Russian--um, and she was a Ger--uh, a Polish immigrant, to come to--to the States. And of all things, back in the '30s, they zigzagged throughout the Midwest. He was in St. Louis, he was in Paducah, Kentucky in the '30s, um, and he, I think when I last counted, through is thirty-seven-page autobiography, he probably had thirty-five to forty-five 00:02:00different jobs that he did over that course of his lifetime.

ELY: This is your great-great-grandfather?

SWITOW: My great-great--do I have that right? My great-grandfather.

ELY: Great-grandfather. Right. Great---great-grandfather.

SWITOW: Yes. Yes.

ELY: So this was in the nineteenth century. This is way back?

SWITOW: Well, no, this was in the, you know, 1930s we're talking. Yes.

ELY: Oh, OK. OK.

SWITOW: Yes.

ELY: So he was zigzagging through here. But there's, um, uh, a story from someone in your family about growing up in Russia and about the poverty in Russia. Is that a story you're familiar with?

SWITOW: Just from that autobiography. So just to correct myself--

ELY: --OK--

SWITOW: --that was actually the 1910s and '20s--

ELY: --OK--

SWITOW: --of when he came over. Um, and so he was the one that wrote that story, his autobiography there, um, which again, I have a copy of, and read--have read--read that to my kids at their bar or bat mitzvah as part of the excerpts from there. Really proud of that.

ELY: Do you remember any great stories?

SWITOW: Just that, you know, I just still can't imagine how someone of Jewish descent ends up in Paducah, Kentucky, um, in the 1910s. I mean, um, and how he 00:03:00ended up outside of the New York, you know, metropolitan south--you know, East--East Coast, ended up in the South is--is really a headscratcher. But I think a lot of it had to do with the direction of the railroad, how they ended up--

ELY: --mm--

SWITOW: --uh, being, uh, different parts in s--uh, of the country there.

ELY: Did you know your great-grandfather personally? Did he live long enough? -----------(??)

SWITOW: No. Unh-unh. He did not. My brother Michael was named after him, and, uh, I knew very little about him until we discovered this autobiography.

ELY: And, uh, any other stories of your family coming, or your great-grandmother, or anyone on the other side of the family? Do you know where they came from in Europe?

SWITOW: I don't. Um, my mom's side, uh, has, I think, roots going back more into the Northeast and the New York Area. And I don't know where they came from, uh, you know, when they came over on the boat.

ELY: Well, one of your ancestors was an important part of establishing an industry in Louisville. Do you have, uh, any stories about the, uh--

SWITOW: Yeah, so that's the movie theater industry.

ELY: --right--

SWITOW: The entertainment industry. So there were two parts of the family business that on the movie theater side, uh, throughout not just the Louisville area, but Southern Indiana throughout the state of Kentucky, the family was involved in drive-in theaters. Uh, best-known in our area was the Kentucky movie theater, the Vogue, the South Park in Preston Drive-Ins, then across the river, um, there was the, um, Rialto, I want to say. And then over in Lexington was the Row (??) and also the Kentucky Theater. And what I remember most was the marquee for the Kentucky still exists today on 4th Street. And my grandfather and two great-uncles' offices were on the second floor there, cluttered with paper everywhere. And there was no filing system. Certainly no computers, as we know. But if you open up the window some, you could a--could actually sneak out on top of the marquee there as traffic was going up and down 4th Street there. That's one of my favorite memories of that. And being that 00:05:00it's still there today, because they've converted that into a restaurant, which I've been to a couple times, I get a smile on my face, good memories of, uh, fifty-plus--fifty-five years ago, being up on that, uh--on that sign.

ELY: And it was your uncles who were running it? Uh, your--

SWITOW: --my great-uncles? Yes--

ELY: --great-uncles.

SWITOW: Uh, so Fred was my grandfather--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --and he was the youngest of the three brothers. And then Harry--uh, and then Sam was the oldest. And Sam ruled the family. It was his way or no other way. Uh, and--

ELY: S--did you work in the theaters as a child, or--

SWITOW: No. So what I worked on is there--the side of the business that spawned off of that was what my dad ran, which was the concession supply business. So when Dad first developed this business with the help of Fred, uh, the business was designed to get concessions into all of our theaters--popcorn, candy, uh, Coke dispenser products, um, the paper goods that went along with it. And then they sort of, uh, s--you know, broadened that business out into Little League parks and swim clubs and the sort. So we had, uh, snow cone machines, 00:06:00cotton candy machines, caramel apple machines, and so forth. Uh, so we were really a drop-ship place. So they'd take M&M's or Snickers. They would have a truck, and in my earlier days, I'd help unload that truck onto palettes, and we'd keep it in an air-conditioned warehouse, because it had to be air conditioned if you have chocolates in the middle of the summertime in Louisville, Kentucky, otherwise your products are going to melt and your inventory's gone. Um, and so that--that's really the side of the business that Dad worked and moved it much beyond just the family theaters, and that's where I worked.

ELY: So as part of the industry from the very beginning, I think one of your--um, your great-grandfather was the first to put up a sheet in the back of his store in Jeffersonville? Does this sound familiar? And show films there, and then that became building theaters, and then it sounds like that then moved into the concessions business.

SWITOW: That's right.

ELY: So every aspect of it was part of your family.

SWITOW: That's right.

ELY: Was there an expectation that you would be part of the family business?

SWITOW: Good question. Um, never had any pressure on us to follow in those 00:07:00footsteps. Uh, in fact, I really wanted to. And one of the best pieces of advice my dad ever gave me was--or, uh, just decisions, no. Because what he saw, the handwriting on the wall was think of it that he was a drop-ship place. So this was before the multiplex screened, uh, theaters that come in, you know, that really have caught the country, you know, by storm. You can't--you don't have neighborhood one-screeners anymore. You have sixteen screens, and they're owned by national conglomerates. So what do those national conglomerates get to do? They have buying power, so they could go directly to Coca-Cola, directly to M&M's, and to Snickers, and to all those products, and they could get drop-ship for their particular theaters all over the country. Somewhere like the Walmart kind of theory, or Costco.

So the middle guy, Dad, his business was getting squeezed, and he saw that handwriting on the wall. And when I was twenty-one or so, I really was anxious to try and work with my dad. And he gave me the pushback, and that was probably 00:08:00the best thing he ever recommended I do business-wise of my life, because I would have been involved in a business that he ended up selling to paper products, which was--was run by Eddie Goldberg. Um, and Eddie bought something, that if you look, think of a chart, this business was doing this. It was there about when Dad sold. It was going to go end up there. So that's why I did not get in the family business.

ELY: So did your uncles and cousins continue to try to run the theaters? Or did they also see the handwriting on the wall?

SWITOW: Well, the theaters were winding down. Um, and then, uh, there were different small partnerships that the Sags (??), which were cousins of ours, helped to develop, and the Switows were involved. For instance, the Village 8 movie theaters, which just recently closed in the last year, or opened up over in Dupont. And so there were different family partnerships that were run. But Dad was more of a passive than an active partner in those.

ELY: And also, the Vogue was your family? That was--

SWITOW: --the Vogue center, yes--

ELY: --until what, fifteen years ago or so?

SWITOW: Gosh, I lose track. I bet you it's been longer than that, though, 00:09:00since it's been closed down and turned into that little strip center there. But everybody still, I think that's been around Louisville long enough refers to it as we're the Vogue--the Vogue center.

ELY: That's a Louisville thing. You refer to thing--places by what used to be there.

SWITOW: And homes by who--who the original homeowner was.

ELY: Which is a little hard on newcomers, but yes. (laughs)

SWITOW: Yes.

ELY: But your family's theaters were an important part of the memories of a lot of people in Louisville. They regret the days that those neighborhood theaters closed. So, uh, it's, um--

SWITOW: Carol, I was everybody's best friend when we started dating on Saturday nights, because double date with me, we'd go to the movies for free.

ELY: Ah. Yeah. Did you spend a lot of time in the movies as a kid?

SWITOW: We did. Oh yeah. It--the hardest thing, I think, for me was, um, realizing that when we sold the theaters, that I actually had to pay to go see one.

ELY: Yes. It's true. It's true. Do you still have movies as a big part of your life?

SWITOW: It is. It's a passionate part of my life.

ELY: --mm--

SWITOW: Love them. And thankfully, my wife does as well.

ELY: Do you have any fingers still in the industry, as an investor, or anything?

SWITOW: Not a single--other than emotional. Nothing.

ELY: Um-hm. So an era passed.

SWITOW: It did. Yeah.

ELY: It did. Well, to, um, st--stay in the past a little bit, um, your great-gran--grandfather also was very involved in Adath Jeshurun synagogue.

SWITOW: --um-hm--

ELY: Is your family still associated with AJ? No?

SWITOW: You know, um, Mom and Dad were the last members there. So as things transitioned, um, not necessarily a wonderful memory, but when I decided to marry someone who was not of the faith and, uh, just didn't go well on--on how it was presented for the conversion process or not, that we found that, uh, the Temple was a better spot for us as--as Reform. And so when Dad passed in 2010, Mom made the decision that she'd rather to go services with us at the Temple, so she terminated her membership as well there.

ELY: --yeah--

SWITOW: So 2011 was about the last time there--there was a Switow that was a member and involved in Adath Jeshurun.

ELY: So growing up, though, you were a member of Adath Jeshurun?

SWITOW: I was, yeah.

ELY: And did you live in the Highlands neighborhood, then? No?

SWITOW: No, so we have always lived off of Brownsboro Road. So we were part of that East End group that moved out that way. And it wasn't convenient at all for us to go there, quite frankly, when you think about it. I mean, traffic was nothing like it is today, but it was still twenty minutes round trip to go there. And so if you think about, we were there on, you know, a lot of Saturdays for services, went back on Sundays for Sunday School. And then when you got to the educational years for bar and bat mitzvah for my--my sister and my brother and I. Um, some of the lessons were taught at the Jewish Community Center, but many were back over at Adath Jeshurun. So all Mom was doing, if I think about it, was she was a taxi service.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: And, you know, so it's forty minutes round trip, and doing it twice a day, or, you know, two times, they drop us off, pick us up, go back and forth. It was really, uh, um, a sacrifice on her part to--to take us back and forth over there.

ELY: Were your parents, um, active in the synagogue? Or did they have other roles in the Jewish community, board memberships and so forth?

SWITOW: So Dad did a stint at one point, uh, vice president, uh, on the board of trustees at Adath Jeshurun. I know that my grandfather Fred and great-uncle Sam and Harry were both active on--on the boards there as well. Um, there was Switow Chapel that I was always proud of, that was at AJ. And I think when they did their last round of renovations, it came--push came to shove. It's money. And they were looking to raise money, and they wanted a significant amount to keep that name on there, and the moment had passed.

ELY: Um-hm. And was your mother active in the synagogue or organizations?

SWITOW: She was really active in the sisterhood over there. Uh, but, you know, at that point, if you think back then, Carol, I don't think there were women on the boards at--at the synagogues--

ELY: --probably not--

SWITOW: --particularly in the Conservative or Orthodox. So, uh, she was active in the sisterhood, though.

ELY: Was she part of any other groups in the community? National Council of 00:13:00Jewish Women, or Hadassah?

SWITOW: She was really active in the National Council of Jewish Women, and now I'm going to rack my brain. She was active, Carol, in the suicide hotline group. I mean, that was--something that was a passion of hers for--for many years outside of the Jewish community.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: And I wish I'd written a few things--things down, because I know there's others--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --and I'm shortchanging her by not remembering right now.

ELY: Right. Did you have a profession outside of raising you and your--your siblings and, uh, working in the synagogue?

SWITOW: She was president and CEO of our house.

ELY: OK. And, uh, in your family, growing up, um, what was your Jewish life like? Did you observe the holidays and Shabbat, and w--what--what kind of Jewish life did you have?

SWITOW: Every Friday night was--our family was spent with, uh, Fred. And Fred had, um, two wives. Uh, Miriam was such a lovely, sweet lady, and she passed 00:14:00when I was six years old. And Fred me--remarried, I think, when I was about nine, or eight or nine year sold, to Rina (??). And so they--they hosted us every Friday night. Um, Dad's brother, my uncle Arnold Switow, would be there as well. So we would have a white tablecloth, uh, dinner, uh, at--at the grandparents'. For a while, they lived at the Brown Suburban on Bardstown Road, and then they moved down to the 800 Building, and that was it. So you--we would from school, go home, change. Five-thirty, we'd be downtown, uh, or--or, you know, get on Bardstown Road for the Kiddush, the lighting--women would go in the other room, light the candles. We'd have the dinner, and, uh, we'd be out of there. So that--that was every Friday night. And every Sunday, the family would meet at Mario's Pizza in St. Matthews, which is now either--I think it's Ratterman's Funeral Home is, uh, but that was the spot, every Sunday night, we'd be there. And a lot of Saturdays, particularly as our--going through our bar and bat mitzvah training, which was required for us to--to be at at least three 00:15:00out of every four Shabbos services, we'd be at synagogue on Saturdays. So it was pretty active, and then during the--Sunday afternoons, as we got older, we'd be over at the Jewish community center, um, my sister and my brother and I, we all were in the--in the--the clubs over there, and we're actively involved in high school and playing sports over there on Sundays.

ELY: Right. The clubs were very important in that era--

SWITOW: --huge--

ELY: --in the lives of Jewish teenagers. Can you talk a little bit more about what went on there, and what it meant to you?

SWITOW: Yeah. Um, so, you know, starting when you were in seventh grade, as you were looking up to the ninth, tenth graders and the sort, it would basically--it was an opportunity to bring different--those of us from different schools into one location. So a lot of us went to Ballard, and then, um, the folks that had stayed in the, uh, communities off of Bardstown Road went to Atherton or Seneca, there were a few at Waggener. But it brought us all together there so that regardless of what high school, you ended up being, at one point, in one of five of the boys' clubs. And it's unfortunate, I think at 00:16:00this point, maybe there's one that would survive, but it was very athletically driven and socially driven. So we would have great sporting events with flag football, basketball, softball, to name a few that would carry us throughout the--the school year that was in competition there every Sunday, and then we'd have practices during the week that would bring us all together. But the--we had memories there that basically, we were at the JCC on Sundays from right after Sunday school at 12:30, and you got home at, like, six o'clock at night. It was--that was part of life.

ELY: Huh. And there were parties, too, and dances?

SWITOW: Yeah. There--so there were social gatherings between the boys' and the girls' clubs there, uh, different socials that--that we would have. And, uh, f--I don't know, I'm thinking, I just want to say formals, but those were more college fraternities, when you could say formals. But there was weekend or whatever they called it, um, but it was a lot of fun to look forward to. And some of those friends, we still have fun today poking fun at each other, that 00:17:00you were in that club, and we beat you at that time, and so on and so forth, back and forth.

ELY: Do you feel like your circle of friends was mostly, um, Jewish kids that you knew from--uh, from the clubs? Or did you also have high school friends? Was it a mixed group?

SWITOW: Mine was mixed. And I think it was driven--it was interesting, Carol, that there were--there was a division in the Jewish community. There were those of us that were out in the East End at Ballard High School that were the country club kids. So we went to Standard Country Club, and we were the ones that played golf and swam out there. And there was another group that was more in the highlands that went to the Jewish Community Center. And I wouldn't say there was a rift or something, but there was a clear distinction between the two. So again, I think because of some things I did competitively with golf and with playing basketball, I ended up having a balance of friends that were both Jewish and non-Jewish.

ELY: Huh. Uh, you mentioned the Standard Club. Can you talk a little bit more about what it was like to be a kid and have access to that facility?

SWITOW: So my smile comes on my face because that's really important to me. The--what folks forget is that on River Road and Zorn Avenue, which is now a field where they're running high school track, was a golf course. And that golf course was built in 1875, and it was the original Standard Country Club. And through the middle of that piece of property was this train trestle, and this train trestle--my uncle, uh, was a big guy, and not a good golfer, but occasionally he could clock a golf ball, but nobody could ever get it over the train trestle on their drive, and it was a blind shot where you land on the other side. Well, he, as a kid, got it over there, and ended up hitting somebody with his golf ball, and went running off of--(laughs)--it was--it was a--the first--he was the first to have hit the ball that far. And, uh, you know, it was really cool that it was the Switows that started it there, but more importantly, where it moved to in 1952 was instrumental, was Fred--was more Sam and Harry and Fred Switow that got it out there to where it is today. And it 00:19:00was nine holes, and, uh, the nine holes, uh, became eighteen holes in 1961.

ELY: So the Standard Club essentially started as a golf club, but then expanded into other facilities? Is that right?

SWITOW: To a point. It had a swimming pool in there initially, and maybe, uh, a tennis court or two built after that. At that time, Carol, you asked me if I had friends that were both Jewish and non-Jewish. We did, but there was a very--written rule, I mean, that, uh, clubs were discriminatory. And the reasons that Jewish Hospital was originated back in the nin--you know, early 1900s, uh, or earlier than that, I lose track of time, was because Jewish doctors weren't allowed to practice anywhere else. And on the country club side, if you wanted to belong to a country club, there were so many of them that--that we weren't allowed to--to a--to join, and maybe had a few problems with even visiting there. So that's where the country club was developed there, so that Jewish people could play golf.

ELY: I'm going to jump ahead in time, and then we'll go back again. There's an effort today to preserve the--the Standard Club for the community. Have you 00:20:00been involved with--with that, uh, trying to think through the twenty-first century Standard Club, and what it will be?

SWITOW: Yeah. Did they tell you to ask me that question?

ELY: No, they didn't.

SWITOW: OK.

ELY: I--if it's a question you're not comfortable answering at this point, that's fine.

SWITOW: No, I'm very comfortable answering, but I'm also the guy that's, um--

ELY: I spoke with Louis Waterman who--who spoke with great fervor about it.

SWITOW: So there--there were three of us that, uh, s--saw an opportunity to preserve the--the Standard Country Club. So the Standard Country Club was in debt, and there was a note held by the bank, and the bank was going to call the note, and the bank didn't want to do that politically. Didn't want to do it emotionally either, but they have a responsibility to do things. And so there was this group of three of us that orchestrated this, Carol, so that we, um, made an investment from the Heritage Foundation into Standard Country Club, not because we want to be in the golf business, but we did this because it was an 00:21:00opportunity for essentially to take that 148 acres and maintain a golf course there, and--and have a community center. And our vision was, and still is, to a point, if we can get the rest of the community to join on our bandwagon, is essentially make it a spot in--on the East Side of town that would be for community meetings. Could be for theater presentations, could be for boys' and girls' clubs, could be for camps. Because on that property, you have golf, you have tennis, you have swimming, you have fishing, OK? You can run. I mean, there's all kinds of property and activities that can be done there. And I saw it, as did a few others, that there's nothing else like it. If you think about it, there are community centers, there are health clubs, there are golf clubs, there are houses of worship. Where's one all in one? That's what this opportunity is, there.

So it's exciting. So we bought it, um, at a discount as an investment for the 00:22:00foundation of which we have the right we could sell it. Uh, but we're there to make a difference with the--with the Heritage Foundation. And if the investment turns out that we make money because nobody else joined on our bandwagon, then we have a fiscal responsibility, financial responsibility to an organization to do that. But that's why we're there.

ELY: OK. It's interesting to hear the different parts of town that have meaning for different people. And clearly, for the people who grew up in the East End, that's a--a key spot, along with, for a lot of people, the Jewish Community Center. So that's why I asked. So now we're going to talk about you again, and go back in time. So, uh, where did you go to college? If you did go to college, where did you go to college? Yes.

SWITOW: I did, yes. Um, so I was a mediocre student. My, uh, mantra is C students rule the world, and that's what I was, a C student. Um, I--what else? I didn't let my classes interfere with my college education. So I--

ELY: Did you go to school locally? Or--

SWITOW: I would--actually, I--at that time, it was easier standards, and I also had aspirations of excelling in golf, so I wanted to go south. And I went to 00:23:00the University of South Carolina for one year. And that was an OK experience. I certainly could have stayed academically, but I decided that the cost and everything else, I ended up transferring back to University of Kentucky. And so in '77--uh, '76 and '77, I was at, uh, South Carolina, and then from '77 to '80, finished up my last three years in Lexington at UK.

ELY: And, uh, at either place, were you part of, uh, Jewish groups? Hillel or anything else?

SWITOW: Great question. Um, no. And it--uh, there was--there was just--w--those two schools, particularly Kentucky. Let me talk about that, while I was growing up. All the Jewish kids from the Louisville area that were going to go out of state, or to state universities, IU had a great Jewish presence, because you had the Chicago folks and the Detroit folks coming down, and there were probably three different--at least two or maybe three different Jewish fraternities and a couple different Jewish sororities. There was barely 00:24:00enough to hold a minyan at UK--at Kentucky. Now that's really changed with the help of Eli Capilouto, who's the president over there, who's Jewish, and also with Mark Kornbluh, who is head of, uh, the College of Arts and Sciences. And you probably may not know this, but now at UK, there is, uh, a three-hour accredited class in Yiddish--

ELY: --mm--

SWITOW: --at UK. But it wasn't like that when I was growing up. Th--there were very few Jewish kids that were there. So it--for the holidays, you know, thankfully, I was just but an hour away, that I could come home for, uh, those, but there was very little Jewish, uh, influence at all there back then.

ELY: Have you stayed involved with UK, and, uh, you--you seem familiar with what's going on there now. Are you--

SWITOW: Yeah. So I'm one of those rare breeds. I'm on a board of the University of Louisville and the University of Kentucky.

ELY: --ah--

SWITOW: It's not all about sports.

ELY: So you wear purple a lot, I notice.

SWITOW: Uh, it's not all about the sorts. You know, blue suit with red underwear maybe, or something.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: Uh, but--or a red tie, but, um, at University of Kentucky, I am on the, uh, advisory council at the College of Arts and Science. And I've been actively 00:25:00involved in other things. I've been actually the one that's helped to coordinate getting, uh, the university introduced to the Heritage Foundation--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --because we thought--and, you know, myself leading the way that, um, it was very important to introduce those that have never had really access to--to Jews, to let them know that we don't have horns, and that, uh, they need to know about our religion as much as anybody else's. And so we've had, uh, with University, uh, submitting some great proposals, some grants that we have over there. And my hope is that we f--spread this out to Western Kentucky University and Murray State and Morehead and Eastern Kentucky University. It's not just UK, but UK, um, was the first one that came to us. So I've been actively involved, and have gotten to know Eli Capilouto, the president there.

ELY: --hmm--

SWITOW: Uh, and it's really, uh, just been a wonderful experience.

ELY: Great.

SWITOW: And I'm also, like I said, on the--on the board of the University of Louisville. I don't want to slight them at all--

ELY: --(laughs)--

SWITOW: --and I love the advisory board I'm on there that connects the business 00:26:00community with, uh, the students there. So I--I like supporting both of it. You know, the Louisville Board supports Louisville, and the Kentucky Board supports my alma mater.

ELY: Great. Um, so have you traveled to Israel? Has this been part of your Jewish identity, your Jewish education?

SWITOW: I've never been.

ELY: OK. Uh, you plan to go, I bet?

SWITOW: Someday.

ELY: Someday. Um, OK, so when and how did you meet your wife? You said you've been married twenty-eight years? So--

SWITOW: Yeah. Uh, I didn't meet my wife very far from this studio. We were fixed up on a Friday night, and we met at a bar. But we--it was a fixup at a bar, and, um, it was, um, my f--it's my--it is my first marriage, and it will be my only. Uh, and it was Tammy's second. And so when we got married, I became a husband and a father in one fell swoop to a, uh, a six-year-old son who actually 00:27:00now works with me in my business, and has. And, uh, for the last, almost four years, and made me a grandfather of twin boys, six months ago.

ELY: Congratulations.

SWITOW: Thank you so much.

ELY: Yeah. And, uh, your family mentioned that your wife wasn't Jewish.

SWITOW: Right.

ELY: So how did you negotiate that in your--you know, as personal as you wish to be, you know, in your relationship and in--and in--in, uh, raising your son? W--did you have a--a kind of Jewish family life?

SWITOW: We did. Yes. So, um, we talked, and--and, uh, Tammy made a commitment that we would raise our children Jewish. And both Sam and Katie were, uh, bar and bat mitzvahed. Ryan was, uh, a convenient Jew. So when he was in grade school and high school and could take off for the holidays, he came to services with us, to get out of school.

ELY: So you had two more children along the way?

SWITOW: Yes. Yeah.

ELY: Yes. OK.

SWITOW: Yeah. So Ryan at this date in--in 2016 is thirty-three, and Sam's twenty-four, a recent college graduate, and Katie's an undergrad down in North 00:28:00Carolina at a small college down there, High Point. And she's twenty. So we agreed to raise them, uh, with a Jewish influence there. And with Mom and Dad being around, we still lit the candles on an occasional Friday night with them, celebrated, uh, you name it. Um, celebrated Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur with them, Hanukkah, Passover. The Seders would be at our house or Mom and Dad's house. And then I became what was coined, um, a C&E Christian, Christmas and Easter.

ELY: --ah, OK--

SWITOW: That's a C&E. So, you know, we--I would accompany her, and--and, uh, enjoy going to her services and supporting her as well.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: But we light candles, and the sort.

ELY: And, um, OK. Um, switching topics, yeah? Uh, your family's been affiliated with Jewish Hospital for a long time too, I believe.

SWITOW: --yeah--

ELY: Um, primarily in the--the business side. Is that correct, rather than medical?

SWITOW: What do you--well, no body--I'm sorry, nobody was on medical staff 00:29:00there. That's correct.

ELY: Right, right. But--but fundraising and governance?

SWITOW: Yeah.

ELY: So who got involved?

SWITOW: You know, Carol, that's a great question, as far as what, uh--my dad was never involved with Jewish Hospital, but I know that, um, Sam and Harry and Fred have some influence there. And then in 1996, I was asked to come on to the foundation board and served on that board, um, until 2002, and then the overlap was from 2000 to 2012, while it still was Jewish Hospital, I was on the full board. So I was the first Switow that I know of that was on the board there. Sam, Fred, and Harry might have been, I just never saw the records there.

ELY: Uh, I think they--they did fundraising. I'm not sure if it was a board membership.

SWITOW: Yeah.

ELY: But, um, the foundation, the Jewish Hospital Foundation, what was the mission of the foundation? But it still exists, is that correct?

SWITOW: It does still exist.

ELY: --OK--

SWITOW: Um, and it's confusing.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: Um, but the--the mission is that, uh, they are there to, uh, raise money to extend grants for medical research. That's really the sole mission of that foundation, to, uh, you know, explore better ways to practice medicine, and keep us all safe and sound.

ELY: And, uh, then when the Jewish Heritage Fund for Excellence was established, could you tell me a little bit about the history of how that happened and what the relationship was with Jewish Hospital?

SWITOW: Yeah, that was a very interesting negotiation. So they got a bit contentious as Jewish Hospital and Catholic Health Initiatives, CHI, were coming together, of who was buying who, whether it was a merger of equals or whatever. And it got down to about the eleventh hour, and there was going to be a--um, an agreement made that was strictly going to be the Jewish Hospital side was going to have a minority ownership in the bigger entity. And a couple of us just sort of said, wait a second. Let's take a little smaller percentage, and 00:31:00let's--let's--how about some money, and that money is going to go into a foundation? So I think part of my dash when I die, on my headstone, will be I was one of the ones, um, that were--are responsible for having a pool of money that we got. So Carol, it's public record. We negotiated out that we got, um, $70 million to put into the Heritage Foundation, and then we had to decide what we were, and I'll get into that in a second. And then we had, uh, a few other dollars from Four Courts Nursing that were sold out that rolled into that as well. So essentially, we started with about 75, $80 million. And I'm proud to say a mere four years later was giving away a fair amount of money every year. We're worth $100 million.

And so as we formed ourselves, part of our responsibility back to the medical community was that a majority of the funds that we give out each year would go 00:32:00for medical causes. And then the balance would go for Jewish causes. So it's a great board to be on. We don't fundraise; we don't ask anybody for any money. In fact, I don't--you know, nobody's ever given us any, uh, because we don't ask. So all's we do is we meet to make sure that the money is properly managed, and then we look at grants, and we give money away. What a great place to be.

ELY: Uh, how were the first criteria established for what you would give money to? More than half to medical research, and then the rest within the Jewish community of Kentucky is the mandate?

SWITOW: You know, there's some grey area in there, but we hope that, you know, most of it should stay within Kentucky. And there's--there's debate on whether it's Jefferson County, or it expands out. And you know, as I mentioned earlier, we've ex--you know, given grants over at the University of Kentucky. So it's beyond just the boundaries of Jefferson County. And we can go into Southern Indiana, but there were negotiations back and forth, um, and it's not--I'm not 00:33:00being coy, I just don't remember how all them came together, but there was definitely give and take of how we were going to do this. Uh, backing up on the--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --negotiations between Jewish Hospital and CHI. It's like one of those jokes, you know, a rabbi and a priest walk into a bar. Well, the rabbis and the priests got into a room. Um, and I don't know if this has come up in any of your other interviews, but they listed out ethical religious directives, ERDs. And they said, OK, here's what's important to the Catholics, here's what's important to the Jewish community, and there were eighty of them. Out of eighty ERDs, seventy-eight of them were agreed upon between the Catholics and the Jews. There were two areas that there were, you know, differentiations, and it's pretty easy to guess. It's abortion and stem cell research.

So some of the things that the foundation will do is separated out from Catholic Health Initiatives. If we're going to fund something that might have been Jewish Hospital-directed, it's not a conflict, um, for the Catholic side of it 00:34:00that we're stepping into something that they don't endorse.

ELY: So you could fund stem cell research, for instance? I see.

SWITOW: We could. Yes. So seventy-eight out of eighty is a pretty interesting stat. I'll always remember that.

ELY: And, uh, how do you see the fund having an impact on the community in the future, and what are your broad goals for it?

SWITOW: So my goal is maybe different than others, but I believe that in the first four years, we've helped to sustain and keep alive certain programs that may have died on the vine. It might be getting seniors bussed from one place to another, it might be getting, um, you know, youngsters, five, seven, ten years old into different programs after school, or, you know, during the summer months, OK? That's great, and that is really important. That's what I would call our blocking and tackling. That's what we have to keep in place. But I've got this vision that we've got an opportunity with this amount of money, that we 00:35:00can do something on a very grand, spectacular fashion. I hope it's the Jewish Community Center-slash-Standard Country Club that come together as one. It may not, but that's my hope and my vision. If it's not that, it's something else. We have enough money to last for generations and make a real impact and a real difference for something that could have never happened without this sum of money. And maybe if somebody used this in thirty years, and they say, "Hundred million, that's not much." But in today's dollars, that puts us at about one of the top five foundations in this area. It's significant.

ELY: So, um, looking at the Jewish community in Louisville today, there's certainly challenges, and there are certainly issues. How do you see the community having changed or evolved over your lifetime?

SWITOW: I think that started on the religious side first, that, um, it wasn't--I wouldn't say unacceptable, but it wasn't the norm that you would have 00:36:00Jews marrying outside of the religion. And now it's much more the norm. And so, you know, members of the clergy have--and it was embraced much earlier on in Reform, but it's--it's--it's flowed upstream to the Conservative and maybe even the Orthodox that this is going to happen. And--and if they want to keep at least fifty percent of that family engaged, they better understand that they--that they--that those kind of couples should--shouldn't be shunned.

ELY: --mm--

SWITOW: So I think that's the first thing on the religious side. And it's unfortunate that there is no, uh, Jewish Day School anymore. Um, you know, maybe they'll be resurrected. Um, so that's an unfortunate thing, is in regards to the religious side. In regards the, um, I guess, the community side and the social side, it's blurred lines now. It's not as d--as clear divisions as it was for my grandparents, my parents, and pretty much for me. Um, I mean, I've gotten invitations to belong, to join certain clubs in town here that I think my 00:37:00grandfather might roll over in his grave if I accepted. But the point being, to answer your question, that's what's changed, that I think we've all come that--so Rodney King, why can't we just all get along?

ELY: Um-hm. Uh, some people have identified the problem of young people leaving and not coming back to Louisville, so that there's a kind of absence of millennials, for lack of a better word. Do you see that as an issue, and do you have any ideas about that?

SWITOW: It's certainly an issue when you have thirteen-plus-thousand families when I was young, and now there's less than eight thousand families. And you look at the amount of those families that have, as I put my fingers up, that are in that twenty to thirty-year-old--twenty to thirty-five-year-old grouping. It's a lot--hell of a lot less than it ever was. I see the tide turn a little bit, though. I think between the entrepreneurial mindset of Louisville and the fact that it's a virtual world, that you don't have to be in a Chicago or a 00:38:00Detroit or, you know, pick--pick a major metropolitan area in this region, that you can come back here. And I think that the--you know, we're attracting more than we once did. I see a slight turn in that--

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: --to the positive.

ELY: Do you think the foundation has any part in that, or is that not a philanthropic issue, it's more a business issue?

SWITOW: I think it absolutely will have a part. Understand, we've only been giving money away for four years.

ELY: Right.

SWITOW: But as we give this money away and establish more of these programs that will attract executives to accept positions, or even start businesses up here, accept positions with companies that offer jobs for them here, or for them to do startups here, and they look at what's involved in the Jewish community, you know, again, back to my hope dream and vision. Imagine they come and they say, gee, there's a place that's got a golf course, uh, a community center, a swimming pool, a camp. They have theater there and everything. Nobody else ever has anything like that. This is really unique here. And they actually 00:39:00even have--perhaps, you know, they can hold services here, you know, as--as makeshift sanctuaries. We don't see that anywhere else, that's pretty unique. So I think the impact of the--of the Heritage Foundation through the years, um, uh, is going to have a real positive effect.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: Now understand, I'm a positive person. My glass is always half full, so maybe I'm a dreamer. But I do see it on--on the upturn.

ELY: Um, have you had experiences with antisemitism in Louisville in your personal or professional life? Or do you feel that that was a previous generation that dealt with that, and it's--it's done?

SWITOW: Sure. I d--can't imagine for any of us that have crossed out of, um, the bubble and--and--and interacted with other parts of the community that you can't--you couldn't--everybody's encountered that. It's how you've dealt with it. Do I encounter it today? Not overtly.

ELY: And today you're in--uh, your profession is--

SWITOW: So I'm in--in financial management.

ELY: --um-hm--

SWITOW: I manage people's money, and so--

ELY: A few Jews are in that business.

SWITOW: What's that again?

ELY: A few--a few Jews are in that business, yes.

SWITOW: Yes, a few of us are in that business. And, um, Carol, I have just as many clients that are not of the faith, um, that are my clients as those that are.

ELY: Um, good to hear. Um, have--have you seen other, uh, changes in the community in the way Jews interact in the world? Um, have you, uh, felt in your personal life that--that, um, being here in the twenty-first century is--is new? And--

SWITOW: Let's--let's talk about it from--

ELY: --OK--

SWITOW: --from a short, from a community service angle. So when my grandparents, or even parents got involved, where did they get involved with? Their synagogues, the federation, Jewish Hospital, the Jewish Country Club. Today, I think you'll see--you'll find members--uh, Jewish members that are involved in Baptist Hospital, Norton's Hospital, Univer--on the university-level 00:41:00boards, both in Kentucky, UK, and at University of Louisville. And by the way, the chairman of the board of University of Kentucky, Jewish.

ELY: --hmm--

SWITOW: OK? You know, uh, so I think that you see that members of the Jewish Community are in--in a lot areas that they once weren't giving access to, or even considered giving their time to. So on--from a community service level, big difference today in this generation than it was two generations ago.

ELY: Mm. Well, I have run through my list of questions. You asked me about that at the beginning. But is there anything that, um, you would like to talk about that I haven't asked you about? Anything that you think it's important to be, sort of, a story on the record, or a thought on the record, or an opinion on the record?

SWITOW: Hmm. May have to cut the tape, and I may have to think about this for a minute. Um, so Carol, I--I think the most important thing, um, or what--what rules my life is that--a--and we'd had this at a, uh, a dinner party just 00:42:00recently. And I was sitting across the table from someone who was Catholic. And I s--we were just going back and forth after--over a glass of wine at dinner. I said, you know, how often do you go to church, you know? How often do you go to confessional? And I asked--and he goes, "Why are you asking all these questions?" I said, "I'm just curious, because I don't go to organized services very often. I'm very close with my rabbi. I mean, I consider him a very good friend of mine, and when I can reach out, and which I did recently about a very personal problem, family issue, that I--I could trust him." And he s--and the guy challenged me across the table, he goes, "Do you consider yourself more religious or more spiritual?" And I said, "I'm clearly more spiritual. I'm very proud of being Jewish. Um, uh, if you go through life and you don't try and treat people as good as yourself but have a mindset 'I'm going to treat everybody better than I would want to be treated myself,' it'll pay you back in spades. Um, and it's just the way life works in that way."

So I think our community is laden very heavily with those that are spiritual. I'm being completely respectful for those who are religious and are devout and go to minyan and go to Shabbat services, and everything else like that. I respect them immensely if they're doing it for reasons for themselves. But spiritually, um, I think it's very prevalent in our community, both on all sides, but particularly on the Jewish community, that you can look at attendance at services, is nowhere near indicative of how strong the spirituality is of the Jewish community here. That, to me, is the most--single most important thing that I could tell you.

ELY: OK. Well, thank you for being willing to be interviewed, and sharing your thoughts.

SWITOW: I'm honored. Um, as I told you when you called, there's none of us left. I mean, I have a brother who's nine years younger but he lives in Singapore. Yeah, Sam Switow, my son, um, twenty-four, he's not quite qualified to do this yet. And so if you look in the phone book, it's me. So I think you 00:44:00got me by default, but I appreciate, uh, the honor of--of being able to represent the family.

ELY: Well, a--a long legacy with your family. So--

SWITOW: Thank you, Carol.

ELY: OK.

[End of interview.]